Mothra LarvaeMember9 XPMay-04-2014 8:24 PMSo in Godzilla vs. Destroyah (I'm calling him Destroyah, not Desotroyah, deal with it), we all know that the crustaceans were mutated in Tokyo Bay by the Oxygen Destroyer when it was first activated to kill Goji. However, in Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah, they erased Godzilla from the timeline, ensuring he never existed up until that film. That means the original Goji never existed, the Oxygen Destroyer was never created, and the Destoryah organisms were never mutated by it. Just thought of this and I had to get it out of my head, post it on the forums.
Be yourself, for everyone else is taken.
GodzillaMember5639 XPMay-04-2014 9:21 PMDERP BATRA - Hmm, you've raised an interesting point here. I like this a great deal! Let's see here; it's true that the Oxygen Destroyer would never have been USED, but Godzilla's removal from the original timeline does not necessarily preclude the oxygen destroyer from being CREATED. It's possible Sherizawa's creation somehow ended up in Tokyo Bay regardless of Godzilla's existence. That being said, that seems to be a bit of a stretch. You might very well be right with you supposition. A VERY interesting topic! :)
BaragonMember307 XPMay-04-2014 10:16 PMInteresting idea, OP. But as Something Real said, just because the (original) Godzilla was erased from the timeline does not preclude someone else inventing it.
In any case, I think one should not think too hard about this, the Godzilla series have not been the most logically coherent series, to put it mildy. That has not stop me from enjoying it though. :)
Mothra LarvaeMember0 XPMay-04-2014 10:25 PM
This should help understand the Heisei timeline. I admit, I still find it confusing even after reading it. :P
Mothra LarvaeMember26 XPMay-04-2014 11:10 PMSapohireoverlord linked the same article I was going to but yeah, as stated, the 1954 incident still occurred as Destoroyah would keep refering to "40 years ago"
the godzilla in the heisei era is clearly a second godzilla, not the same one that attacked in 1954.
this second Godzilla was identified by Miki due to the Osaka event and this dinosaur felt like that godzilla.
i understand the burning question is how the dinosaur turned into godzilla and stayed there for thirty years before popping up, but my theory as silly as it sounds is that the dinosaur was displaced into the sea when it was exposed to radioactivity and went dormant until awoken by the volcano.
anyway, 1954 still occurred, so Destoroyah would still exist.
GiganAdmin4953 XPMay-04-2014 11:20 PMTeam GhidorahI'm glad two people beat me to the punch. But in short the Heisei Godzilla is NOT the same Godzilla as the one in 1954. So Godzilla still attacked Japan in 1954 and the Oxygen Destroyer was still used, just on a different Godzilla.
Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah only focuses on the origins of the Heisei Godzilla, revealing he was born in the 1970s before he attacked Tokyo in 1984.
GodzillaMember5639 XPMay-04-2014 11:50 PMGMAN2887 - You know, I didn't know that? Thank you very much for the clarification. I was starting to think myself into a mild coma over this topic! :)GiganAdmin4953 XPMay-05-2014 12:16 AMTeam GhidorahWell if you think about it, how could the Heisei Godzilla and original Godzilla be the same? The Heisei Godzilla was 30-50 meters taller and the original was clearly disintegrated by the oxygen destroyer. Nothing's coming back from that. Plus there's a line in Godzilla vs. Destroyah, "We need to kill him the same way we killed the original Godzilla." (Referring to the Oxygen Destroyer.)
The Heisei timeline makes sense, it's just the sloppy writing from the 1990s films made it difficult to understand. I copied and pasted this list I compiled of the Heisei timeline from this thread eons ago:
1944 - The Futurians go back in time from 1992 and transport the Godzillasaurus from Lagos Island to a Pacific Ocean trench.
1954 - Bikini Atoll tests awaken the first Godzilla who rampages Japan and is later killed by the Oxygen Destroyer. The Oxygen Destroyer begins mutating pre-cambrian lifeforms.
mid-1970s - A Russian nuclear sub sinks in the Pacific Ocean trench, mutating the Godzillasaurus into the Heisei Godzilla. (As Terasawa discovers from a news clipping in Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah.)
1984 - The Heisei Godzilla makes his first landing on Tokyo and is later dropped in Mt. Mahara.
1989 - Godzilla returns, attacks Japan and fights Biollante. He is then infected with ANEB sending him to sleep on the ocean floor in the Pacific. Biollante's G-cells make their way beyond Earth.
1992 - The Futurians arrive from 2204 to plot a way to hold Japan for ransom. They return from 1944 after leaving the Dorats and take control of King Ghidorah. While they were gone Godzilla moves from where he was sleeping in the Pacific to the ocean trench where he was born. (Making everyone think he disappeared from history.) Godzilla then attacks a nuclear sub and absorbs the modern radioactivity which mutates him 20 meters taller. He fights King Ghidorah, attacks Tokyo and is later dropped in the ocean by Mecha-King Ghidorah from the future.
1993 - Battra and Mothra awaken due to Earth's pleas and Godzilla prompts them to join forces against him. Battra dies in the process and Mothra leaves Earth to deflect an incoming asteroid.
1994 - The UNGCC is formed and the remains of Mecha-King Ghidorah are recovered from the ocean to build Mecha-Godzilla for G-Force. Rodan is found and does battle with Godzilla. Both monsters attack Japan in hopes of finding Baby Godzilla and Mecha-Godzilla is destroyed as a result.
1995 - G-Force builds MOGUERA and the G-cells from Biollante (or Mothra?) have completed a mutation, known as SpaceGodzilla. It arrives on Earth and attacks Japan. Godzilla defeats him and MOGUERA is destroyed in the battle.
1996 - Bass Island explodes causing a massive increase in Godzilla's nuclear heart. Destroyah is formed from the pre-cambrian lifeforms that have been mutating since 1954. Burning Godzilla does battle with Destroyah who is finished off by G-Force. The remaining radiation from Godzilla's meltdown is absorbed by Godzilla Jr and presumably leaves Japan alone.
2100s - Japan becomes the most powerful nation in the world.
2204 - Terrorsits steal a time machine from the EUO to alter Japan's history. One of them returns from 1992 to salvage King Ghidorah's remains and fight Godzilla in the same year. Her mission is a success and she returns to her time with no changes to the timestream.
Mothra LarvaeMember0 XPMay-05-2014 2:43 AMGhidorah messed up the timeline so bad. Barely any time travel movies don't fix contradictions. I know people have found ways to explain things making sense but to me its just kinda reaching. I love how they come back and say that it worked and that Godzilla never attacked Japan yet they all remember him. Now he's replaced by Ghidorah who's been under the Futurians control for decades but they only wait until the present to unleash him. I could go on and on and yes I've read the reasons behind the article posted hear but I really do think any referencing in the films to events before 91 are just pot holes. Even more reason for me to be agitated with Space Godzilla for one of the main characters spending the whole film trying to kill Godzilla to get revengeance for something that was erased from the timeline.
It's all opinion though. Maybe the timeline isn't as broken as I believe but at least G vs. KG was a great movie, I thought after those first three films it was downhill for the Hesei series.
BaragonMember307 XPMay-05-2014 4:10 AMGMAN-
It only make sense from fan reasoning. The producer and scriptwriters never bothered to explained it well (hence they never thought about this clearly). The fact it make senses is only a coincidence, and not by design.
GiganAdmin4953 XPMay-05-2014 10:47 AMTeam Ghidorah@GodzillatheKing123
I used to think that myself, but I don't believe that's true anymore. Did you read Keith Aiken's article? He clearly points out what Kazuki Omori had intended through the screenplay and what had been established before. Omori's a sloppy writer, but he's not stupid. All the elements are there for it to make sense they were just poorly written for audiences to understand immediately.
I would think a man who has been close to Toho and the production crew of these various films would pick up more of what was intended than write an article about fan conjecture. That's not Keith's style, nor is it Sci-Fi Japan's. I've spoken with him on the subject before and he's quite convincing that this was the intention. To undermind the idea that a professonal screenwriter like Kazuki Omori would miss that entirely is actually less likely.
