Movie Tournament Rounds 6-8 Archive

Hmm this is a tough one since I love both films.

King Kong vs Godzilla doesn't take itself seriously at all so you have to factor that in when watching it. The movie characters and monsters are all there to have fun. I love the Godzilla suit, it's a shame it never got used again with the next suit straying pretty far from it's design. That being said maybe that's a positive as it gives the suit the distinct look that makes it stand out, even at a glance someone can tell that is the Kinggoji suit. Kong on the other hand doesn't look too great. Even by the standards for monsters at that time I can't help but not like that suit. The suit actor does a great job of making you almost not care by how well he portrays an ape. That aside wasn't impressed with the look of Kong. The characters are there to to get the movie along, obviously aware what type of movie they're making with acting that reflects it. Of course the highlight of the movie is the final fight. It's extremely entertaining having the monsters throw rocks at eachother, knock eachother around, and even try to stuff a tree down their throats.

I can't help but love Godzilla vs King Ghidorah for how original it was. I mean they go into Godzilla's past something that's remained vague and shrouded up to that point. They also tackle timetravel which isn't the easiest thing to write for. I think that fact so many people are confused about heisei's timeline is because of this movie, thinking Godzilla was actually erased and while the movie could have been clearer, I don't think it was as hard to grasp or understand as some people seem to act. The characters are fine some shining more that others of course. Miki doesn't do much a trend she'll follow up until Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla, but Emi, and Shindo and M11 are the real people that I think made the movie better. Overall like King Kong vs Godzilla this is a fun movie that you can enjoy at all ages featuring robots, time travel, dinosaurs and finally Godzilla. The suits in this movie are great by the way. Godzilla is basically a slightly altered biogoji, which is my favorite suit so nothing to complain about there, Ghidorah looks great, and I don't think anyone can complain with the design of Mecha King Ghidorah.

I love them both but I have to give this to Godzilla vs King Ghidorah.

GMAN2887 - Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah for me! I very much enjoy the film's tone and more, hmm, fanciful nature! :)

Godzilla vs King Ghidorah all the way.

King Kong vs. Godzilla is considered by some as the second most important film in the entire franchise and a true classic. It get's my vote hands down. 

Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah is entertaining to an extent but just has too many cringe-inducing moments. Changing the great King Ghidorah's origin from a space demon to three gremlins fused together is bad enough. The acting or overacting was bad. Except for Shindo, I did not care much for the other characters including the classic Captain Spielberg. 

Delving into Godzilla's past was interesting but the whole story including the time travel was poorly written and executed.

King Kong vs.  Godzilla has so many enjoyable moments including Godzilla's superkick on Kong and Kong taking Godzilla by the tail and swinging him around. Classic stuff.

"King Kong vs. Godzilla is the second most important film by some in the series."  ×Scratches head×

That may be true, however, a lot more consider Mothra vs. Godzilla 1964 to be the second most important in the series.

King Kong vs. Godzilla is a good film. Love it. Not as much as others though. I find it better than at least 2 that have been eliminated here already. Perhaps we should have a double elimination the next time? 

Ben,
"Important" does not always mean "best". Mothra vs. Godzilla may be considered by many to be the second best film, but its fruition likely came from King Kong vs. Godzilla which is the most attended Godzilla film in the series I believe.

King Kong vs. Godzilla instilled Godzilla's popularity and likely gave birth to the idea of Toho pitting their own monsters against each other. (Why get the rights for others when you have your own catalog of popular beasts?)

And again, I don't cast my own votes in these, but I'm left wondering how Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah is absolutely whooping King Kong vs. Godzilla. I mean, I like Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah. I think there are a lot of parts about it that are really great, but the parts don't exactly add up to a cohesive whole. King Kong vs. Godzilla just works better as a complete film.

This is a tough one, since I consider both of these films to be very much about on par with each other overall. They're both very strong entries in the series, fan favorites, and have their own major strengths and flaws. But, I'll go with King Kong vs. Godzilla. I feel that it has fewer flaws to detract from the experience, and just feels like a better film on the whole.

Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah tries to be a very interesting and unique film, but I think it tries to do too much without adequately explaining it, hence why today many fans still don't understand the consequences of the time-travel in the film on the Heisei continuity. It's certainly a strange film, even by kaiju eiga standards, but it's still enjoyable and has some of the best effects and battles of the Heisei era. I'm not a huge fan of King Ghidorah's new origin, but it works with the time-travel plot of the story, so I can forgive that, much like I've come to forgive his portrayal in GMK.

King Kong vs. Godzilla is probably one of the most fun movies one can watch. It doesn't take itself to seriously while still not seemingl like a spoof or anything, it has quirky interesting characters who provide constant comic relief, and the final battle is one of the best-choreographed fight scenes in the series. It feels like a giant-sized wrestling match, and I absolutely love it. It also set the precedent for pretty much the rest of the Showa series, and few films have matched it. Not to mention, it features King Kong fighting Godzilla!

So, although I think these are two pretty evenly-matched films and some of the finest entries in the series, I think that KKvG is better by a large enough margin to win my vote.

I don't know if I'd say King Kong vs Godzilla worked better. The movie kind of gets carried by the marquee value the two monsters bring. I think if you took out Kong and replaced him with another monster the film wouldn't hold up as well.

Durp,
Even then though the movie feels tailor made for said marquee it builds on with a much tighter script than Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah. Everything about it makes sense and feels like a natural progression. Meanwhile, the time travel angle confuses fans so much that it might as well not make sense for floundering about so much. King Kong vs. Godzilla just has a stronger slate of characters, acting and makes sense out of its ambitious concept. Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah does not.

"Ben, important doesn't always mean the best." 

Okay, where in the hell did I say it was the best?  I know the difference between important and best. Never once did I say anything about the "best." 

I don't know how much I agree with that. King Kong vs Godzilla was essentially a worse version of King Kong with aspects of Gojira thrown in. The movie follows King Kong minus the love interest, which they kind of throw in randomly at the end to add that aspect of Kong to the movie, besides that same idea go to skull island, or whatever they call it in that movie, Kong fights another animal to show how dominant he is in his kingdom this time a giant octopus rather than a T rex they bring Kong back he escapes grabs a girl climbs a building, which is quite funny since in this case he's actually as tall as the building he climbs. Meanwhile Godzilla is just destroying things. Overall I think the movie just followed Kong through the same steps of his original movie done worse, which is understandable since at the time Kong as a monster had more aspect to the character than Godzilla who just destroyed things and was unbeatable. 

I think Godzilla vs Ghidorah went for more ambitious things bringing in time travel and explaining the monster. King Kong vs Godzilla's most ambitous virtue is the combination of two monsters which had been done before in Frankenstein meets the Wolfman aside from that it just took the movies the monsters did before and threw them together nothing new was brought to either monsters outside of Kong's lightning powers and Godzilla's sudden weakeness to it despite never having a problem with it before. As for characters I think it's closer to a wash acting might go slightly in KKvG's favor but not by a huge margin.

Going to have to go with King Kong vs. Godzilla. I find it extremely fun, and also nostalgia plays a part as it was my very first Godzilla film ever given to me. I also simply don't like the direction the Heisei films went with Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah. Coming off the greatness that is Godzilla vs. Biollante, suddenly we have flying time machines, ugly Dorat-muppets, a poor backstory for Godzilla, and not to mention atrocious Android running effects. It's also the reason we didn't get any of the later heisei films released in America for... what?... 10 years? Because it was thought to be anti-American.

I enjoy KKvG for its simplicity and fun factor, so it gets my vote.

I think claiming King Kong vs. Godzilla was "essential King Kong '33 done worse" is missing the forest for the trees. The movie is extremely self-aware and makes no effort to hide the campiness and absurdity of the situation. At the time the idea of two serious monsters from very different types of films being pit against each other was so affectionately a cash grab to Toho that playing it straight makes little sense.

Yes, Kong's arc is similar to that in the 1933 film with attributes flung at the screen as callbacks to the monster's film, but it never feels out of place with the movie's tone. Nor does it impede on the film's momentum or quality from one scene to the next.

Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah, on the other hand, plays the ambitious and ridiculous completely straight with glaring scenes that stick out like a sore thumb. (Why was Emi shocked about the plan if she left the Dorats? After she was capturd by M-11 why was she left alone with him to reprogram him? Shouldn't she have been locked up by the Futarians? ) Add to some really inconsistant special effects which go from great to groan inducing, I don't think there's enough in Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah to really overshadow King Kong vs. Godzilla.

Ben,
The implication was that you were confusing the two. Most people don't consider Mothra vs. Godzilla the second most important movie, but certainly a vocal majority consider it the second best. I've rarely heard anyone defending the former.

Gman2887,

I think you're putting words in my mouth that I never said. How in the world do you get that? I'm not confused here with "important"  and "best." If that's the case then every Godzilla film is "important." 

The only thing that is confusing me right now is you. No offense. You're absolutely right about Mothra vs. Godzilla being considered by many as 1 of the "best"  films. In fact, it is my 2nd favorite Godzilla film. King Kong vs. Godzilla as you put it, helped give Godzilla box office strength. And to say it reflected on Mothra vs. Godzilla is one thing, don't forget Godzilla fought Anguirus first. That means that king kong vs. Godzilla was influenced by Godzilla raids again with monster fighting monster.

My vote is for King Kong Vs. Godzilla. My favorites from Showa will almost always trump favorites from the other eras.

I enjoy the hell out of both, and both certainly require a bit of "check your logic at the front door". I'm not going to go into any lengthy explanations about each at this time. There are certainly plenty of others' opinions/analyses for whom I would be repeating anyway.

And Gman is correct in that KK Vs G was and still is the most attended G film in it's illustrious history. Pretty amazing, if you ask me.

The intention is not to put words in one's mouth nor is that what is happening. I simply addressed that most people believe Mothra vs. Godzilla to be one of the top if not second best film in the series. It would be easy to confuse "important" for "best" in such a conversation. In any case, since I've never heard anyone refer to Mothra vs. Godzilla as the second most "important" film in the series until your post, I assumed confusion was happening.

As for Raids Again, yes it is the original giant monster brawl in a city, but its impact was light. Raids Again did not have the same effect as Godzilla '54 at the boxoffice and Toho decided to focus on other monsters/science fiction for the following six years.

King Kong vs. Godzilla was less an idea cut from Raids Again's cloth and more of an opportunity to create a grand event with someone else's material. After pitting Godzilla against another popular monster proved to be such a success it made sense for Toho to continue the trend with their own popular beasts-- Mothra was immensely successful and it made sense for Toho to pit her against Godzilla.

I don't think we can mention effects when also talking about King Kong vs Godzilla, especially in a negative way. Look at the Kong suit the arm extenders the suit includes to give it a more apelike are so obvious, with it being very easy to point out, not because the extensions themselves, but the random curves and stiff hands, there's also the scene that looks like handpuppets with godzilla and Kong fighting in the background. I think overall even taking the movie's times into account Godzilla vs Ghidorah holds up more.

As for scenes some stick out more maybe in Godzilla vs Ghidorah, not really Emi not knowing about the dorats and the plan for them to become Ghidorah, it's pretty clear through the movie in terms of the Futurians she's at the bottom of that totem pole, so her not knowing the whole plan especially seeing as she was Japanese isn't that jarring, but I don't think that takes out of the movie any more than some of the things the monsters did in King Kong vs Godzilla. 

King Kong also has the misfortune of coming 30 years before Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah, and alot of the miniature sets are superior to GvKG to this day. My complaints weren't with the effects (except the Dorats and the android running), but rather with the poor story telling and the direction it took Heisei in. I'll stick with the straight forward goofy monster mash of KKvG.

Actually I think Tsuburaya's miniature team was much more talented than Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah's and it shows. While the Kong suit is pretty poor, at least the buildings didn't have windows painted on. Even Nakano didn't allow that with The Return of Godzilla.

You have to frame special effects for the genre and time period, and for the time I think King Kong vs. Godzilla has stronger and certaintly more consistant look the special effects-- It was definitely a step forward for the time. Meanwhile, Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah had some glarringly terrible effects shots compared to the previous film (and Gunhed) which were more or less the benchmark at the time. There were some notable steps backwards. I can't really say the same for King Kong vs. Godzilla.

I was also never under the impression that Emi was at the bottom of any totem pole. The fact that she was told to leave the Dorats there without question doesn't fit with her character and she acts completely out of the loop later. Even as the Futarians begin to distrust her they don't bother to lock her up and keep her away from M-11? Sloppy.

I also think the need for Terrasawa and Professor Mazaki joining the time traveling party was poor. I can buy Miki being needed to use her ESP and sense whether or not the dinosaur was Godzilla, but the other two were written into the situation with the bare minimum excuse. It didn't really work.

Are you disagreeing with me? Or disagreeing with Durp? Because my post was agreeing with you... even if it was worded oddly.

That was directed at Durp. I simply didn't address it to him.

ROUND 8 HAS BEGUN:

The forum and twitter votes have spoken and Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah topples King Kong vs. Godzilla 11 to 5.

Next match:

Godzilla vs. Megalon VS. Godzilla's Revenge

Godzilla vs. Megalon was the first Godzilla film I remember seeing as a kid. That combined with my enjoyment of professional wrestling at the time made it possible for me to enjoy Megalon even to this day. It's a silly movie but one that you could enjoy with your kids. Especially like when Godzilla comes to the rescue of Jet Jaguar and cleans house on Megalon and Gigan. I vote for Godzilla vs. Megalon. 

"You stated you were surprised GvKG was trumping KKvG so badly."

Not surprised, but certainly curious. Age likely does factor in to a lot of it, but I'm not that much older than some of the oldest here.

Wow this is even worse than the Godzilla vs Megaguirus and Final Wars one.

Godzilla vs Megalon not because it's great but because it's not a 30 minute after school special about not bullying that is stretching into 90 minutes through stockfootage.

I'd be curious as to what the gmforums users top ten favorite films are. Not even necessarily Godzilla related, but their non-G favorite films may help explain why they prefer some films over others. Like Michael Bay's Transformers fans loving the likes of Final Wars and the flashier films over the meatier/substance imdued films. Maybe a thread is called for.

That sounds a touch harsh. I'd edit it out if I could. Hopefully no one around here serious likes Michael Bay.

^Only loosely related, I'm actually playing this same tournament on another forum to see how opinions vary. I'll share the results of both tournaments with each forum just for the sake of discussion.

It might be comparable if all their favorite films are of the same genre, but if someone likes a different one like comedy and those types of movies make a lot of their top 10 you'd be left with little to compare.